Community DAO Funding Request Q4 2021-Q1 2022

Sejin,

Thanks for your honest feedback. I would like to try to address your concerns and wanted to do so from my personal account so as not to speak for each individual on the dao.

Hello Harmonious_Dude Glad to have the chance to talk with you first, as you know I follow and respect from time ago so I feel very comfortable.
I also want first of all to show gratitude for your positive way to accept a critique and for the time and dedication in your words and explanations.

I totally understand you speaking about yourself, I had a similar feeling when creating my post, you guys are a DAO, and it’s impossible to talk at 10 persons as one, and must be similar to reply also in the same way.
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" but almost every time I got no reply"

I am very sorry for this and took the time just now to review the personal messages you are referring to. It looks like only one comment was not met with a response (regarding the time of our spaces), but I did notice that a couple of times it took a couple of days to respond. I apologize for that and hopefully we can try and get more immediate responses to you in the future. Unfortunately we are still working on ways to engage the community more and have not figured out a way to properly utilize all willing volunteers. If there was a specific concern with one of the responses you did receive (or did not receive), please elaborate, so that we can try to better answer your concerns or questions in the future. There are multiple people that manage the account and perhaps we need to assign one or two people to better control the content and avoid being slightly disjointed in our response time, etc. Also, if you care to include any specific suggestions, I very much would like to hear them. I want to serve the community.

I already guessed that the account would be used for different individuals and not only one making it more difficult to keep the positive feeling of being talking with someone in a conversation that maybe the person at this moment has not initiated. I saw it already on several DAOS using the same account and I addressed them this issue too since I think is crucial for a DAO to make people feel cared for when addressing topics with them. So I encourage you guys to consider a solution for it

Talking about my experience. I know well When I contacted you the first time I could be looking just like a random neophyte without any special weight, asking maybe trivial questions.
Especially comparing myself to the veteran roster members in your DAO.
And that’s ok, because that’s exactly what I was, and perhaps what I still being.
But this makes a very important point.
I think Community Dao should (and particularly because is the “Community DAO) consider everyone who contacts you, whatever is their popularity, leverage, number of followers, or friends, to be treated with the MAXIMUM possible attention. Making no distinctions among and trying always to be polite, well mannered, and kind.

And if you wonder why, is simple: because you’re going to be in a power position representing the harmony community, and the way you talk, you address, and you respond to the people can make a HUGE difference and impact in how people perceive harmony as a whole.
Everyone on the DAO who uses the Twitter account should be very careful about this, even if maybe they are used to have a lot DMs and messages in their personal accounts due to popularity since popularity can create a few impolite habits when addressing people, and in personal accounts that is ok, but in the DAO account is not.

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“later just send me what I would consider almost link spam without even say “hello””

Admittedly, this is not my favorite way to get word out for our tweets, but I have gone along with it (and even done it myself a couple of times) as the DAO came to a consensus to form an outreach team. We tried to be honest with the intention of it being to get retweets and that if anyone wishes to be removed from getting those tweets sent to them, then we would glady take them off of the outreach team. The reason for no ‘hello’ or other dialogue within these tweets is because we are sending them to quite a few people and writing individual messages to each person would be quite time consuming. I do agree this is not the most elegant way of communicating our message and perhaps needs to be reconsidered now that our follower count is climbing and our reach is expanding.

On this point and with your permission I am going to dare to explain to you that is a common mistake and misconception I have found often in Harmony to believe that the number of retweets, the number of followers are directly related to the number of people you will reach, and the impact you will cause on them. And is not.

In fact, I can prove anytime how smaller accounts that are not focusing on pushing people to retweet or spread information are much more efficient spreading messages across a community than those who are mechanically and repeatedly asking users to retweet or spread a message.

The reason behind it is the fact that sending an impersonal DM to someone asking to share a tweet. Does not make that person connected to you and to the message, so finally, that makes that the original information in the tweet that might be originally interesting and valuable, becomes an advertising asset that no one really cares or even reads.

My advice here is to change the strategy, if you guys already noticed that doing this is making you behave cold with people and you feel unsatisfied with it, just stop. Try to spread information in a different way, text people and call them by their names, give them some feedback, talk to them as a person and then ask them to help:

I’m gonna give you a good example about how to do it:

“Hey Mrx, How are you today? Here is the community DAO! I am contacting you because we got some interesting news about this xxx event happening in harmony now. We believe this is quite important and we are trying to get the community involved. Would you mind reading it when you have the time, and maybe give us some feedback about it? We would appreciate it a lot and if you feel comfortable with it maybe you can share it also among your network!”

Does it require more time? Yes. Is it more complex and just send a DM with a Link? Yes.
But it is much more effective and makes people feel better and helps to spread the message? Yes yes yes

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“more focused just on their personal inner circles and their individual interests and values”

I can promise you I speak for everyone on the DAO when I say that this is not at all our intention and I would love some elaboration on this point so that I can look introspectively and see what I may personally be doing to give this impression. We may struggle in many ways, but we never wish to favor ourselves over others.

As I mentioned before, popularity can have a very heavy side effect on the way we behave with other people. This is a psychological effect that happens when someone has a lot of attention since from that moment, having attention is not very valuable anymore.

Find a person who receives their first DM in the network related to their job or their value and you will find a happy person willing to read it and to respond.
Now find a person who is having messages every day and you will find someone who often doesn’t even want to read those DMs

The only way to address this problem is to work on it, use will, and decide to respond to everyone who contacts you like if it was the first day.

If you want to really know what makes people in your roster feel far away from the community and look like if they pertain to some elite inside of harmony the answer is Feedback, Attention, and communication:

Not giving credit or feedback to new people, to strangers, or to people who are more little than you in the community avoiding interacting with them. To have tons of followers but following back only to very few fellows. To not give likes and congratulate people like others do to you. All these things make someone look alienated and disconnected from the global group and engaged only to those who they consider equal around them.

Totally fine for a personal account of someone who enjoys popularity like if it was the high school, but not appropriate for DAO working for the community! Is something that needs to be cared about!

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“establishing a goal of having 5000 followers while you don’t follow back the people of the community that you are representing I think is very wrong.”

Our main reason for this goal was to extend our reach so that any future initiatives or governance proposals can be made visible to as many people as possible. This seemed like a reasonable milestone for us, but I understand your point. Perhaps we should set a standard of following back everyone if you and others feel it is important. It would take some persistent legwork at this point given the limitations of twitter in that you can only follow a set number of accounts per day without being tagged as a spam account. Like I said, though, if this is seen as an important goal by the community, I think we can get to work on it.

I would love to see you and I will respect and applaud that you follow back to every member of the harmony community that follows you.

Because they are the community you are willing to represent, and if you can’t do something so basic as following them back, then how are they going to feel they are represented and cared for by you?
And more importantly, how are you going to listen to the community if you don’t even follow them? I don’t know who among you decided to encourage it but it was a huge mistake that does not help the DAO.

I think you should change your goal, and instead of saying “We want 5000 persons to follow and hear us” you should say “I want to hear and listen to what 5000 members of harmony have to say”

And I’m gonna promise you something in a personal note. If you do this, the reach you are going to have is much stronger and wider than following just a few.

(For last dont worry too much. You can follow back around 50/100 of your followers every day and you will be fine in a few weeks. There are even calculators for this and following people has almost no penalty by twitter, different from unfollowing them which it has.)

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“more polite, more friendly, better mannered, and more equal towards everyone else”

I do sincerely apologize if there is a way you feel poorly treated by the DAO and, if you are willing, would love to know more about why you feel this way.

I will not make it personal, addressing people in your roster who did not even reply to me when I tried getting to know and offering them help on some issues they were asking after attending the first twitter spaces of the DAO, because I’m just an individual and my personal case is meaningless when talking about the community.

So instead I will tell you only that trying to talk with the community DAO account, trying to be friendly like I was, trying to learn like I was, trying to collaborate like I was and having those cold delayed answers and then just random DMs with links without a hello, feels bad. Especially if you are little like and willing to participate like I was. Because it kills the will of being participative.

And I will not lie, Now I have matured too and I don’t mind anymore, but in that moment when I was trying to get to know people and after offering the DAO to collaborate with you, after retweeting your links and seeing that you even did not follow me back, felt quite bad at that moment, like if you consider me irrelevant.

And if it felt bad to me at that moment I can imagine it might feel bad also to other people

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I hope I’ve addressed your concerns at least a little and would like to continue the conversation with you to better ourselves. I’d like to take a moment to share some about our experience in trying to get this Community DAO functional and built for the future. Building it from scratch has proven to be quite difficult. There have been a few obstacles, most notably communication, within the council. While we all have faith in each other’s abilities, there has been some difficulty establishing constant communication with each other to get tasks completed. Several governors have not kept a constant line of communication open and have been difficult to reach for some time. In the interest of being transparent, the DAO has been primarily a team of 5 consistent contributors. Originally our plan had been to split into groups based on, mostly, similar time zones, but also interests and skill sets. This lack of contribution has forced the 5 of us to take on the majority of DAO work and has made it difficult to properly delegate tasks into smaller groups (and perhaps be more efficient) as the others either have outside obligations consuming their time, personal issues they are dealing with, etc. I would like to note, though, that DAO work is at will and no governor is under specific obligation to contribute a set amount of time. I would be lying if I didn’t say it has gotten frustrating as there are many capable and willing community members that would gladly make themselves more available and would be more ambitious to make this thing work.

With that being said, there are a some things I hope we are able to accomplish in the coming months. Being the first persistent council and elected to a 6 month term (future councils will serve 3 month terms), our main goals are to build an infrastructure that will allow transitions to future councils to be more seamless and to work to create future sustainability for the DAO. Firstly, we have composed and ratified our governing charter. This was a big undertaking because we wanted to make sure we built a document capable of providing a governing framework for future DAO councils to reference, removing some of the guessing regarding how to proceed in certain instances, such as passing HCIP proposals. Some other things we hope to achieve in this line of work would be to build a collection of documents and ‘learned experiences’ to hopefully ease the transition period of future councils. Being such a new endeavor, the initial period of this DAO was a little difficult in that we all had an introductory period where we were getting on our feet and figuring out how to proceed. That’s not to say we have things figured out now, but we think sharing any info we have can be valuable as the DAO builds for the future.

As to the second point of sustainability, we are hoping to make some headway towards building a DAO that can stand on its own feet and not be reliant on funding requests such as these. Ultimately it would be great to have funds that just need governance proposals to be passed in order to be used. As it stands, though, the governors putting in time now are left wondering if we will have a multisig wallet with funds in it. It is really beginning to affect productivity. I would say the biggest concern of ours is that we have had this request up for nearly a month now with no response from the team. Do we need to provide something else? Are there deliverables they wish to see us accomplish? Without any response at all we do not know how we are to proceed. To achieve sustainability, we have considered a number of things, but one thing we have gotten positive feedback about and would like to proceed with is giving functionality and use case to the crazy.one domains. When initially launched, it was stated that the funds collected from the purchase of these domains would be left to the Community DAO to manage. We do not have access to these funds at the moment. Currently, the only use case for these domains is showing your most recent tweet. We wish to explore options to allow for many features including, but not limited to, displaying NFTs, allowing personalization of the page, etc. We would love to see crazy.one domains be usable for many things, making them a desired purchase of any community member and thus provide for a sustainable DAO.

We do not wish to limit ourselves to infrastructure and sustainability, though. We have a number of community-requested initiatives we would like to explore and achieve. We must be funded if we hope to achieve any of these things, though. Harmony has put forth the goal of paying DAO contributors and have committed $1 million to help get the Community DAO up and running. We are simply asking for a ‘topping up’ of the multisig with a portion of these funds to help us achieve these things. We are willing to answer any of the core team’s questions or listen to their, or the community’s, input as to what we need to do in order to proceed.

You addressed my concerns pretty well and I am very satisfied, in fact as you know you were one of the first persons I interacted with in twitter after arriving to harmony and you know because I already made it public in the past that I consider you a very valuable member of the community and I admire the work you constantly do.

This intervention of mine was then obviously for the Dao as one and not for anyone in particular.

About the information you shared at the end of the post I truly appreciate it, because it gives a different perspective about what’s going on among you guys and what are the difficulties you are addressing yourselves, it’s very helpful and it gives light to understand much better everything about you

I will not reply here for not make this super long conversation even longer, but I will let my door open in case you guys need some extra collaboration, I am quite familiar with interacting with communities even professionally and I would gladly help you to solve issues related with communication and organization for it, and I am pretty sure many other people in the community would also be happy to help.

Maybe counting and being involved with the community more directly is very positive for the community DAO

Because If you guys fix those issues mentioned here, me, I will be the first to encourage everyone for your funds and for any help you need since I truly believe a Harmony Community DAO is something we really need in this very stage we are.

2 Likes

Hi Sejin,

I took some extra time to get back to you because I wanted to fully consider what you’ve written here and not issue a hasty response.

"Talking about my experience. I know well When I contacted you the first time I could be looking just like a random neophyte without any special weight, asking maybe trivial questions.
Especially comparing myself to the veteran roster members in your DAO.
And that’s ok, because that’s exactly what I was, and perhaps what I still being.
But this makes a very important point.
I think Community Dao should (and particularly because is the “Community DAO) consider everyone who contacts you, whatever is their popularity, leverage, number of followers, or friends, to be treated with the MAXIMUM possible attention. Making no distinctions among and trying always to be polite, well mannered, and kind."

I fully agree with this point. I think one thing to consider is that many of us on the council might be viewed as veterans, but have only been in the crypto space for a year or less. Personally, it is still just under a year since I purchased my first crypto. This space is still so new and we are learning just as much as any other community members. However, with all due respect, I have reread our correspondences multiple times and I do not understand where we were not polite, well-mannered, or kind or how we made some sort of distinction based on someone’s standing within the community. I hope I am not crossing a boundary here and I will remove if you request, but I’m going to share screenshots of each of our correspondences in the interest of transparency for anyone that might be reading these comments. Perhaps after viewing, they will agree that you were not treated fairly in some way and if so, I will gladly listen to ways we could have done better and try to improve.

sejin 2
sejin 3


When looking over these messages, I feel that you were considered and responded to with respect as well as given an explanation as to what the tweets being sent to you were hoping to accomplish and offering you an opportunity to quit receiving them at anytime. If I am missing some underlying issue, please elaborate.

“On this point and with your permission I am going to dare to explain to you that is a common mistake and misconception I have found often in Harmony to believe that the number of retweets, the number of followers are directly related to the number of people you will reach, and the impact you will cause on them. And is not”

There might be some truth to what you are saying, but there is also some data that shows our strategies have been effective in reaching a larger audience. These first two images show the last DAO tweet before the outreach team was formed as well as the 1st tweet after the outreach team was formed. There is a decided increase in the number of impressions with the tweet that we sent to the outreach team.


The next two images show the last two tweets that have been sent to the outreach team. I included two because the most recent was a giveaway tweet, which may have caused more skewed results. But as you can see, the impressions on both tweets are quite high.


The difference in impressions is quite considerable when compared to the two most recent tweets that were not sent to the outreach team. (pictured below)


Another thing to consider is that the DAO account has more than doubled since the creation of the outreach team. That is not to completely credit the outreach team as there are a multitude of factors that could have influenced this, but with the impression increase in the tweets, it is difficult to deny that it contributed to this growth.

All of this is not to say that the account is being managed perfectly because it is not. It is simply to show that perhaps our efforts with the outreach team have had successes.

"I would love to see you and I will respect and applaud that you follow back to every member of the harmony community that follows you.

Because they are the community you are willing to represent, and if you can’t do something so basic as following them back, then how are they going to feel they are represented and cared for by you?
And more importantly, how are you going to listen to the community if you don’t even follow them? I don’t know who among you decided to encourage it but it was a huge mistake that does not help the DAO.

I think you should change your goal, and instead of saying “ We want 5000 persons to follow and hear us ” you should say “ I want to hear and listen to what 5000 members of harmony have to say ”

And I’m gonna promise you something in a personal note. If you do this, the reach you are going to have is much stronger and wider than following just a few.

(For last dont worry too much. You can follow back around 50/100 of your followers every day and you will be fine in a few weeks. There are even calculators for this and following people has almost no penalty by twitter, different from unfollowing them which it has.)"

We absolutely would love to hear from 5,000 community members. I do feel this is a difficult metric to quantify, though. And as I said, if the community feels it important for the DAO account to follow back everyone following it, we are happy to oblige. I have tried this with my personal account until a little while back when i was away from twitter for a bit. Twitter would give me pop up messages after following 25-30 or so accounts at a time. I tried over multiple days and was having difficulty catching up and ultimately stopped trying to follow everyone. You are correct in that it would take weeks to get caught up, but considering our limited participation from several governors and the time constraints of working on a DAO (10 billable hours/week allowed per governor), it would use up quite a bit of our billable hours accomplishing this. One last thing to consider regarding governors on the council: many of us have families, other jobs, and other responsibilities outside of the DAO that sometimes might take precedent and cause the sometimes slower responses. At the beginning of our term, all governors agreed that, no matter what, family and personal health come first. The reason I am sharing this is because I feel it is important to not consider the CDAO as a monolith with industry veterans that think they are part of some exclusive inner circle. We are all humans with personal lives that are trying to create something basically out of thin air and having our bumps and obstacles along the way.

“I will not make it personal, addressing people in your roster who did not even reply to me when I tried getting to know and offering them help on some issues they were asking after attending the first twitter spaces of the DAO”

For this, I apologize. That should not happen. All I can say is that the 3 of us on the council that have regularly been hosting the twitter spaces recently each checked our personal inboxes to see if we somehow missed a message from you, but could not find one. I can only assume it was one of the other governors. I will say that I sometimes go weeks before seeing messages sent to my personal account. It’s not intentional, but unless you follow someone, twitter will send them to a ‘message requests’ tab that I often forget about. It’s possible that is the case with the governor you are speaking about. Still not excusable and I do apologize, but hopefully it can explain a possibility as to why it happened.

With everything I’ve said above, I do hope you understand that I am only pushing back some on some points that I felt represented the DAO somewhat unfairly. I do take your critiques to heart though and spoke with a couple of the other governors yesterday. We do believe it might be more beneficial to limit those contributing on each DAO social media account, hopefully allowing for a more focused and responsive approach. We would also like to make interacting with the community from the DAO accounts more of a priority (not just from our personal accounts) and not just use the accounts to spread a message. You are correct in that being involved more directly with the community would be beneficial. We’ve decided this should be a topic discussed at our next all governor meeting (typically on saturdays).

As far as your support for our funding, we would very much appreciate it. We have been working for a month now without a treasury trusting that we will receive what we are relying on. Not having any response at all to this point has added some, we feel, unnecessary stress around the holidays.

Thanks again for your detailed response and I hope now the community can review what I’ve said here and provide feedback, whether it be positive or negative.

3 Likes

Hello! Do not even worry, I understand we are busy, right? And in this scene we both live and breathe, I think every one of us feels like days are not long enough to be able to spend as much time as we wish we could writing, replying, and exchanging opinions and ideas.

So I appreciate that you are taking the time to hear and fix these issues and especially doing it publically what I understand might feel a little uncomfortable but also brings valuable transparency.

Not big issues about sharing screenshots of a part of our conversations with the DAO. After all, I might be wrong hundreds of times, and a few times I might be right, but in any case, around all my interactions and opinions in the community, I am very comfortable being transparent and I have nothing to hide related to my opinions and actions. Now, about other details that are displayed in that conversation, what can I say? At this point I am quite used in Harmony to find people (that when discussing with me) shares in public unrelated details about my personal identity (like in this case, nationality, persona) that I shared prior in private and are not relevant for the context! Not my first rodeo.
I don’t know, I want to think maybe around the globe we might just have different approaches and ways to understand respect, identity, and privacy because I think I know you and I do not think you are trying to use it as a weapon in our dialogue since that would be considered a type of doxing and I know well you are much better than that and it would not be allowed in the forums we are right now.

Anyway! After this introduction, however, I will just quote the parts of your conversation that I will reply to make it easy to read, (after all the full conversation is here for anyone interested in it) and since I do not have negative feedback I don’t think it will bring anything out of context!
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Your answer about my personal experience with the DAO:

I fully agree with this point. I think one thing to consider is that many of us on the council might be viewed as veterans, but have only been in the crypto space for a year or less. Personally, it is still just under a year since I purchased my first crypto. This space is still so new and we are learning just as much as any other community members. However, with all due respect, I have reread our correspondences multiple times and I do not understand where we were not polite, well-mannered, or kind or how we made some sort of distinction based on someone’s standing within the community. I hope I am not crossing a boundary here and I will remove if you request, but I’m going to share screenshots of each of our correspondences in the interest of transparency for anyone that might be reading these comments. Perhaps after viewing, they will agree that you were not treated fairly in some way and if so, I will gladly listen to ways we could have done better and try to improve.

When looking over these messages, I feel that you were considered and responded to with respect as well as given an explanation as to what the tweets being sent to you were hoping to accomplish and offering you an opportunity to quit receiving them at anytime. If I am missing some underlying issue, please elaborate.

I understand you consider that you replied and interacted with me fairly well and I do not feel the same way, and that’s ok. It seems like we have different ideas and concepts about how to interact with people, especially when one holds a certain rank name or position and in this case, that position is no more and no less than a Community DAO.

So I will give you my personal perspective and I hope that if even you do not agree with it as I might not agree with yours it helps you to understand better a different approach and perspective:

My first contact with the DAO was after attending to several Spaces to hear what you guys had to say, I was fairly new and missing knowledge about many things and I was happy to find a DAO that seemed to be a source of knowledge who maybe I thought could help me and guide me to understand and be part of the community it represents.

Someone mentioned me in that space and I couldn’t reply so I decided to follow you and send you a DM almost immediately expecting some conversation. But it did not happen, and I was not followed back by you so I did not now know well why I wasn’t getting even a reply after being directly mentioned in the space.

The next day when the DAO wrote me back I did not feel very good, after all, I was expecting you to give me some guidance or bring me some help, but surprisingly it was the DAO who was asking me to help them which according to my intentions and needs at that moment was very disappointing.

Anyway I wanted to be positive and I accepted your petition but when in the next few days and even if I was doing my best helping and sharing your links and attending your spaces, you still did not give me conversation or help and not even make me feel appreciated by following me back, so I felt you were being quite rude and acting too much important.

It happened more times, and every time you contacted me was just for sharing a link so I finally felt you were just using me and spamming me so I lost interest in communicating with you and I found others who helped me to understand and be part of harmony better even if they were not the Community DAO!

I know you think you acted very well, but tell me, can you catch at least the feelings I experienced? Or imagine that other people can feel similar to me? If not, at least it would be enough if you can just appreciate that sometimes we are not as right as we think we are from other people’s perspectives.
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Your answer about tweets and impressions:

There might be some truth to what you are saying, but there is also some data that shows our strategies have been effective in reaching a larger audience. These first two images show the last DAO tweet before the outreach team was formed as well as the 1st tweet after the outreach team was formed. There is a decided increase in the number of impressions with the tweet that we sent to the outreach team.

Another thing to consider is that the DAO account has more than doubled since the creation of the outreach team. That is not to completely credit the outreach team as there are a multitude of factors that could have influenced this, but with the impression increase in the tweets, it is difficult to deny that it contributed to this growth.

All of this is not to say that the account is being managed perfectly because it is not. It is simply to show that perhaps our efforts with the outreach team have had successes.

I consider you quite a sharp interlocutor and I am quite sure you could for a moment stop thinking in impressions as a way to measure your success because impressions for people who don’t even care about what you write or who you are mean absolutely nothing for you to grow up and reach the community.

In fact, you could buy impressions for a few dollars, and in fact, that’s what you did when you did a giveaway with $.

And the fact that you are using it here to show how efficient your progress it means you are really missing how Twitter and how almost any social network work.

If you want to have a valuable account that has attention and contributes, you need to stop watching numbers and you need to start analyzing your contribution and your feedback and especially the interest in you and your content coming from the people who are interacting with you

Do they follow you because they really care about your message or because you are giving 500 $ONE in a giveaway? Because I have quite experience in giveaways and I can tell you 95% of the ppl participating can not care less about who you are and what you say, and every follower you gain with it is a follower who doesn’t mind you at all.

As a DAO whose goal is to be representative of the community, you need to grow organically by showing to the community that you really have things they might need and they might care about (and you need to generate those things btw…) and when they experience that they are having something positive from you, don’t worry, they will follow you fast. People appreciates quality content and interesting information. And those who follow you that way are quite better than the ones who follow you for a chance on 500 ONE. (I can tell you some accounts have thousands of followers in harmony using those strategies but in the end, no one really cares about them and they have no echo)

A very professional approach to encourage people to give you attention, see your profile and check who you are and what you do is. (surprise) to follow them first!. It not only makes them feel good but also makes them curious about who you are. I recommend this approach over all the other approaches you are doing right now.

Create quality content, follow people, give them something they value and you will build a real community that will give you much more benefits than random impressions.

And about your numbers even if you seem to feel proud and even if you decide to not consider what I explained and elaborated for you here, and since I don’t have data from other people than myself, I can invite you to choose any of my recent posts on my Personal account (with 4 times fewer followers than the DAO), and you’ll see how I have larger numbers than you have by having fewer followers and fewer retweets, in both, proportion and quantity, and I am nothing else than a new and personal and irrelevant account.

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But because my interaction with people is more natural, more friendly, and more honest than yours my reach is also stronger in numbers, but especially is stronger if you don’t see the numbers. And I repeat, am no one, and I should be nowhere near to a community DAO especially being our accounts similar in age and use. I hope it helps to understand a bit better how numbers are not that relevant.
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Your answer about Following back the community:

We absolutely would love to hear from 5,000 community members. I do feel this is a difficult metric to quantify, though. And as I said, if the community feels it important for the DAO account to follow back everyone following it, we are happy to oblige. I have tried this with my personal account until a little while back when i was away from twitter for a bit. Twitter would give me pop up messages after following 25-30 or so accounts at a time. I tried over multiple days and was having difficulty catching up and ultimately stopped trying to follow everyone. You are correct in that it would take weeks to get caught up, but considering our limited participation from several governors and the time constraints of working on a DAO (10 billable hours/week allowed per governor), it would use up quite a bit of our billable hours accomplishing this. One last thing to consider regarding governors on the council: many of us have families, other jobs, and other responsibilities outside of the DAO that sometimes might take precedent and cause the sometimes slower responses. At the beginning of our term, all governors agreed that, no matter what, family and personal health come first. The reason I am sharing this is because I feel it is important to not consider the CDAO as a monolith with industry veterans that think they are part of some exclusive inner circle. We are all humans with personal lives that are trying to create something basically out of thin air and having our bumps and obstacles along the way.

Please I encourage you to just follow the community members who follow you back and do not make any more excuses for it, this should be your responsibility as a community DAO and you should not even think of not doing it.

By the way, I will remove your fears using information from the Twitter Help Center, and don’t worry just clicking a tenth of times every day the follow button on your profile should not affect the personal life of your governors significantly:

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Your answer about my personal experience with governors and about the interaction and workflow of the governors in your DAO

For this, I apologize. That should not happen. All I can say is that the 3 of us on the council that have regularly been hosting the twitter spaces recently each checked our personal inboxes to see if we somehow missed a message from you, but could not find one. I can only assume it was one of the other governors. I will say that I sometimes go weeks before seeing messages sent to my personal account. It’s not intentional, but unless you follow someone, twitter will send them to a ‘message requests’ tab that I often forget about. It’s possible that is the case with the governor you are speaking about. Still not excusable and I do apologize, but hopefully it can explain a possibility as to why it happened.

With everything I’ve said above, I do hope you understand that I am only pushing back some on some points that I felt represented the DAO somewhat unfairly. I do take your critiques to heart though and spoke with a couple of the other governors yesterday. We do believe it might be more beneficial to limit those contributing on each DAO social media account, hopefully allowing for a more focused and responsive approach. We would also like to make interacting with the community from the DAO accounts more of a priority (not just from our personal accounts) and not just use the accounts to spread a message. You are correct in that being involved more directly with the community would be beneficial. We’ve decided this should be a topic discussed at our next all governor meeting (typically on saturdays).

As far as your support for our funding, we would very much appreciate it. We have been working for a month now without a treasury trusting that we will receive what we are relying on. Not having any response at all to this point has added some, we feel, unnecessary stress around the holidays.

Thanks again for your detailed response and I hope now the community can review what I’ve said here and provide feedback, whether it be positive or negative

As I mentioned before in the message you quote, that personal part with me that happened in a DM with one or more of your governors is really not more relevant than what we have already talked about, and after all, at this stage of the conversation they might have noticed well about it, and I am not important, the community is, I prefer we focus just when governors are using the Twitter account to talk with people.

Now, after talking with you in public and meanwhile having other conversations in private we need to realize that you guys are having some issues in your work and communication flows that are affecting not only your results and goals as a DAO but also affecting those of you who are more involved and at the same time more limited due to the inactivity of others.

In this case, I suggest:

  • Consider and decide a minimum of time and tasks that every governor involved in the DAO should use every day/week to contribute to your goals and your schedule. Ask them to understand and to commit to it, and if for some reason they can not do it, ask them about the possibility of stepping back and finding a way to allow someone else interested and available to take their position. The DAO should not be negatively affected by the personal lack of time or personal issues of one or more governors in particular. Especially when is a DAO working towards the community

Other than that as I mentioned before, please reconsider in this upcoming meeting you have the way you are approaching the community and find a more friendly and positive way of doing it, follow back the community so you can hear better, fix your internal communication issues and be open like you are right now in this space to interact with however contact you and even offer yourself as a guide and helping hand to those how just land in harmony short ago.

Do this and I promise I will be first on the list to ask for funds for you because I truly believe we do need a good community DAO to be a guide and caretaker of everyone of us and take important responsibilities interacting in Harmony, and I fully believe you have the potential for doing it.

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It is late here and I feel like this is getting a little away from the topic at hand, which is that our governors, myself included have been putting in many hours without being funded or even acknowledged or given guidance by the core team after being promised funding for our term to which we were elected. I myself have put in roughly 60 hours of work towards the dao now with a depleted treasury. I have a wife and two kids and I consider anytime spent away from them to be valuable time. All of this is in addition to time spent interacting with and helping build the community from my personal account. Not having funding (or acknowledgement) is not just beginning to affect the morale and productivity of the council, but the amount of support we are receiving from our loved ones in pursuing this endeavor. How much time should we be expected to continue to contribute when we can’t look at our significant others with a straight face and tell them we will get what was promised to us? It is not fair to us or them, particularly around the holidays.

I went ahead and removed the first photo of your correspondence with the dao because I did not intend to give out any info that you did not want out there. I was just wanting to illustrate that I thought it was an acceptable response. Perhaps it is a cultural thing and I am happy to acknowledge that I will reconsider my personal contributions to responses to those that reach out to the dao in the future with this in mind. I still do not think there was any ill will behind it at all and do not think it was a response acting as though we are ‘too important,’ but its a point that I’m willing to concede that we may see it differently. As I said in my last response, we are humans that are not much more experienced, in general, than most anyone in the community. We simply saw the call for candidates and signed up for elections just like anyone else was open to do. We were fortunate to be elected and I will always appreciate the trust the community showed me.

As for the tweets analytics, there are so many things that can be argued one way or another and the fact is we could possibly both be right at the same time. Sometimes tagging a large group of followers can be effective as in some of your tweets. As for the giveaway tweet I shared, I only did so because it was the most recent tweet we had sent out to the outreach team. I admitted that it wasn’t the best sample because it was a giveaway tweet, which is why I also included the one before it. I will say about the giveaway tweet, though, that we did not ask for a follow as part of the giveaway, but rather a couple of tags and for the user to comment what they liked most about Harmony. Any users that simply retweeted the post without adding a comment was disqualified from the giveaway. We do not want to make giveaways a common theme of the Community DAO, but thought it might be fun to give away some ONE on New Years Day and engage the community to share what they love about Harmony, which I see no harm in doing.

I have admitted, though, that our handling of the twitter account is not perfect and needs to be tuned. Should this keep us from getting the funding we were promised, though? We are trying afterall.

As for following everyone: I just now attempted to follow as many people as I could. After only 30 follows, I received this message from twitter.
iRDJJrwP
Now perhaps you can follow 400 accounts in a single day (I haven’t fully tested that), but it cannot be done quickly as shown with what I just experienced. I still believe it would be a large undertaking as it would require multiple logins a day with a 30 follow limit each time. But, if deemed necessary, it can be done. It is unreasonable for us to take this on without clocking hours for it, though.

As for the governors in the DAO that are not participating, your suggestion is quite good and we actually attempted almost this exact thing with an internal document at the end of November. Unfortunately, a couple of the governors did not even view the document and we have been unable to establish communication with them. The others have seen and agreed to the document, but have still been fairly inactive, yet responsive. I do not believe anyone has interest in quitting. I agree the dao should not be affected by a lack of involvement. One thing I will say is that as a part of this document, we made it clear that we had no intention of signing off on hours if other governors could not vouch for them or if there was no work shown. I wish very much that a simple request to dedicate more time was sufficient to get things back on track. The charter that I helped draft in October/early november, while fairly thorough, did not account for a situation where so many governors would be so uninvolved. As it is written, we do not have enough votes to remove anyone. The only solution would be to draft an appendix to the charter and have it passed as an HCIP vote, which would probably take 2-3 weeks for the process to be complete at minimum. This is an option I am considering, but I do not want to be reactionary and if I move forward with it, I want to make sure it is done right and for the right reasons because it would be a change to our governing document.

As I said, we will gladly analyze the way we are conducting our social medias and continue to be self reflective. We do not carry special status and do not see ourselves as above reproach. But I will ask again, should this be a reason that we are not given the funds we were told we would have at our disposal? How many hours without being acknowledged should we work before our funds are given? It would be incredibly unfair, not just to us that are still working hard, but to our families, to expect us to work towards building a DAO and to take on initiatives from the community when there are no funds currently to make them happen?

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It looks quite obvious after reading your messages (And I am sure they will be read by the right people) that in your case, you are truly committed to your assignment and you are doing what you have been asked for, so yes, of course, you deserve to get funded for the work you’re doing and there is not even need to imagine special dates or familiar situation, you deserve it, in any case, or circumstance, period.

And I am quite sure you are not the only one and there are other active governors who also deserve it as much as you do.

The problem here with the funds, is we all know around here that there are people who abuses the system and the trust where it resides, and in the same way that it is unfair that you have not yet received the funds that you were promised to, it is also unfair that there might be others who are not even responding calls and they might receiving funds for it.

This is one of the reasons why I think it is an emergency matter to try to resolve this issue of communication and workflow you guys are having as soon as possible. First by talking once again this time in even a more serious tone with the rest, and if they continue without even responding or caring then there is no other solution and this needs to be formally reported in harmony, and the people causing the issue needs to be called out since the community also needs and the community deserves to know about this so they know where their votes are going to. The system is currently based on trust and needs to be cared for and respected.

Meanwhile, on the other side of the spectrum we were talking before, and now that almost everything has been said. Basically, please even the few of you who are currently active try to make sure that you do not leave messages unanswered, that everyone has a dedicated reply, and stop the link spam and instead at least try to make a custom message more personal. This should be enough to address the most significant part of this side of the issue.

Continue following people back on Twitter as you are doing today and do not worry about reaching the limit in this way since is not penalized, and simply continue the next day when it reaches the limit.

Said this, as long this is done I, myself do not see any inconvenience and I also ask to move this petition forward and get you funded as soon as possible. But only if as I mentioned, this issue with the rest of the governors not participating/answering is addressed as soon as possible in any possible way, since the situation they are creating is negative for the DAO itself, for you the ones truly working on it, for us the ones voting and for the harmony governance system and for everyone else in the community, and this has to be prevented to continue happening.

Once again thanks for your illustrative and since replies and explanations that are bringing light to everyone about the current situation.

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I appreciate you sejin. As I have illustrated, we are making our best efforts given the circumstances. I assure you, we have not signed off and paid anyone for time that was fabricated. We review our clockify entries before payroll is calculated and discuss any discrepancies we may see. Our wallet requires 6 governors to sign off before a transaction is completed. I am not worried about funds being stolen.

As far as taking two days to respond to you before, again I apologize. I urge you to take these same feelings and apply it to our current situation. We are now at 30 days since this post went live. We have not been given a reply. Instead of our feelings at play, it’s our livelihoods and families depending on this. At the same time, posts in other forums have been made by the team celebrating all of the DAOs that have been funded, as we wait here biding our time. 30 days. With no dialogue. Should Harmony not be held to a higher standard than that? I hear your concerns over a slight delay in response time while at the same time, those of us still holding on the the dream of DAOs are left here feeling abandoned. If something is needed for us to be funded, they should’ve let us know long ago. Please consider taking your own critiques of the DAO and ask why we can’t get a response here and how it must make us putting our faith in this process feel.

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I don’t know why I did not see the notification for your reply, maybe it was just my fault and I missed it

I also value a lot the conversation we have had here, truly.

And I am so pleased to hear you giving us your word about it and speaking for the others, that you guys are caring so much and so well about the time paid and not allowing anyone among you to abuse it. It sure satisfies me and everyone to know that no one is taking harmony money and responsibilities towards it, not in an absolutely serious and respectful way.

About your inquiry one among many things, however, I am seeing here is that some of the politics inside of the system really need to be revamped. And yes not only of course for making sure everyone is paid when the due time comes as long they have been doing their job well and they can prove it

But also because seems like we might need to make the voting system more efficient so no governor can join in a DAO and do nothing but looking pretty and important while holding that position meanwhile others like seems to be your case, are working hard doing extra job instead of them and later have to deal with problems like now because of this.

There are flaws in the system that need to be polished, starting for increasing the amount of participation of the community in these forums votings and decisions creating awareness and doing better promotion of the system and then start to consider modify whatever is necessary, after what I have learned here I am going to get involved on this

About the dramatic part of your personal situation, I am only sorry to hear about that, I am very serious. I totally feel you. Sadly the only I can say about in this very moment in the waiting is that if you or anyone else is having is those kinds of personal difficulties related to personal situations and economics, even more, if it’s affecting a familiar situation maybe should consider politics as not the best field to participate in since inside of politics there are many reasons for delays to happen when it includes economics and payments, and I am sure there are reasons for this delay, and I also want at this very moment than everything has been explained to hear a reply about this and about the delay to know more about what’s going on.

Until then my best wish and thanks for being brave to talk in name of the DAO and expose the situation clearly for everyone. This is important.

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Hello @HarmonyCommunityDAO –

I have two important items to discuss with you all. One is the approval of this request and the other is an apology.

The request for a $100,000 grant is approved. Please visit harmony.one/grant-funding to submit the details.

The apology is mine. I am sorry for falling behind on the DAO grant requests. I have been a little distracted by the end of year events and deliverables - but I am working through my backlog and you should see a flurry of activity on my end in the next few days.

Looking forward to continuing to work with you all.

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Thanks for your reply, we have submitted the details on the form :pray:t3:

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Thanks @ben2k_Stakeridoo!

@HarmonyCommunityDAO - congratulations! This request has been approved and funded.

Thank you again for your patience. Good things are happening on the DAO ops front!

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